Again, though, burgers vary. Yesterday, mine included sliced red onion, arugula, and a slice of swiss. No ketchup, no mustard, etc. I did put dab of olive oil based herb sauce (that I had made prior to this) on it. Yes, I’d say that the bread was by far the most processed part of the meal. I’m just not convinced that this burger was worlds away from a steak and a side salad.
I know not all burgers are the same, but that is the point isn’t it? I found my meal hyperpalatable, but should it be considered ultra processed? If it should, then how should we distinguish it in discussion from even more processed versions? I don’t have an easy answer for this.
I don’t see how we refine the definition when the entire idea of “ultra processed food” is a Catch-all with no precision or nuance. I get that it makes some conversations easier, but I’m not convinced it’s a useful concept overall
I don’t know if you’re intentionally being contrarian or you legit aren’t comprehending the story.
Are you taking offense that your home made meal is being called out in this one line, “The top sources included burgers and sandwiches, sweet baked goods, savory snacks, pizza and sweetened drinks.”?
Are you not comprehending that this is referring specifically to the total calories coming from ultra processed foods and that these foods include burgers? It is not saying that all burgers are ultra processed. It’s saying that the category of highly caloric ultra processed foods includes, among many other things, burgers.
The same could be said for pizza. If I make a pizza at home - flour, yeast, tomatoes, mozz, oil - it’s not going to have any ultra processed ingredients. If I go to Pizza Hut and get a meat lovers pizza with a stuffed crust and ranch dressing, that’s going to be ultra processed.
These are simple words used to broadly define categories of foods with the assumption that people understand they’re not going to list out every fast food and restaurant burger in the United States sorted by calories and ultra processed ingredients.
These are simple words used to broadly define categories of foods with the assumption that people understand they’re not going to list out every fast food and restaurant burger in the United States sorted by calories and ultra processed ingredients.
Yes, and these are the words that most likely appear in the retrospective survey results on which these studies are undoubtedly based. My point was that equating a set of words that describe end products (like ‘burgers’, or ‘chicken soup’) with a set of words that describe preparation (‘ultra processed’, or ‘minimally processed’) is not at all straightforward. Any word (or at least many) in one set could be mapped to almost any in the second set. I just chose ‘burger’ out of convenience. If you told me you had chicken soup for lunch, could I automatically know if it was ultra processed or not? Would a researcher know?
Sure, the person eating it can probably tell. But often that information isn’t collected in the survey being used in a study. Standardized questionnaires don’t necessarily capture this information. Some of these studies are built on old datasets because they are looking for long term affects. Sometimes all you have is ‘burger’, or ‘chicken soup’. Sometimes you have even less than that. Sometimes all you have are the answers to questions like, “In the past six months, how many times per week did you eat red or processed meat?”.
Now, sure, some studies are based on surveys that collect information about the level of processing, but these have issues too, ranging from moving the interpretation of what processed is over to the subjects of the study, to protocols that include verbose food diaries that no participant could be expected to adhere to for long.
Sure but most people aren’t making their own burgers or soups.
Like yeah some of them might own meat grinders and have a butcher down the street, but for the majority you’d be lucky if they even fried up their own (likely ultra processed) bubba burger. They’re going to in and out and McDonald’s.
From my short visit to north America, I was shocked how little people made from ingredients and how much from ready-to-eat instant stuff.
Yup we eat a lot of ultra processed nonsense because we waste hours a day everyday just getting around the country and then even more time listening to pointy headed bosses. Our lives kinda suck it and most of it revolves around our jobs. The US is basically an industry-run dystopia.
My wife and I try to be better and buy real ingredients to make food, but after a long day at a shitty job it’s hard to find the energy to make a real meal instead of throwing some frozen rubbish into the oven for a few minutes.
Again, though, burgers vary. Yesterday, mine included sliced red onion, arugula, and a slice of swiss. No ketchup, no mustard, etc. I did put dab of olive oil based herb sauce (that I had made prior to this) on it. Yes, I’d say that the bread was by far the most processed part of the meal. I’m just not convinced that this burger was worlds away from a steak and a side salad.
I know not all burgers are the same, but that is the point isn’t it? I found my meal hyperpalatable, but should it be considered ultra processed? If it should, then how should we distinguish it in discussion from even more processed versions? I don’t have an easy answer for this.
I don’t see how we refine the definition when the entire idea of “ultra processed food” is a Catch-all with no precision or nuance. I get that it makes some conversations easier, but I’m not convinced it’s a useful concept overall
I don’t know if you’re intentionally being contrarian or you legit aren’t comprehending the story.
Are you taking offense that your home made meal is being called out in this one line, “The top sources included burgers and sandwiches, sweet baked goods, savory snacks, pizza and sweetened drinks.”?
Are you not comprehending that this is referring specifically to the total calories coming from ultra processed foods and that these foods include burgers? It is not saying that all burgers are ultra processed. It’s saying that the category of highly caloric ultra processed foods includes, among many other things, burgers.
The same could be said for pizza. If I make a pizza at home - flour, yeast, tomatoes, mozz, oil - it’s not going to have any ultra processed ingredients. If I go to Pizza Hut and get a meat lovers pizza with a stuffed crust and ranch dressing, that’s going to be ultra processed.
These are simple words used to broadly define categories of foods with the assumption that people understand they’re not going to list out every fast food and restaurant burger in the United States sorted by calories and ultra processed ingredients.
Yes, and these are the words that most likely appear in the retrospective survey results on which these studies are undoubtedly based. My point was that equating a set of words that describe end products (like ‘burgers’, or ‘chicken soup’) with a set of words that describe preparation (‘ultra processed’, or ‘minimally processed’) is not at all straightforward. Any word (or at least many) in one set could be mapped to almost any in the second set. I just chose ‘burger’ out of convenience. If you told me you had chicken soup for lunch, could I automatically know if it was ultra processed or not? Would a researcher know?
I have a feeling people can tell the difference between home made chicken soup and Campbell’s if they really try hard.
Sure, the person eating it can probably tell. But often that information isn’t collected in the survey being used in a study. Standardized questionnaires don’t necessarily capture this information. Some of these studies are built on old datasets because they are looking for long term affects. Sometimes all you have is ‘burger’, or ‘chicken soup’. Sometimes you have even less than that. Sometimes all you have are the answers to questions like, “In the past six months, how many times per week did you eat red or processed meat?”.
Now, sure, some studies are based on surveys that collect information about the level of processing, but these have issues too, ranging from moving the interpretation of what processed is over to the subjects of the study, to protocols that include verbose food diaries that no participant could be expected to adhere to for long.
Sure but most people aren’t making their own burgers or soups.
Like yeah some of them might own meat grinders and have a butcher down the street, but for the majority you’d be lucky if they even fried up their own (likely ultra processed) bubba burger. They’re going to in and out and McDonald’s.
If you buy arugula, that’s an unprocessed ingredient. If you buy ready-made pickles, that’s a processed product.
From my short visit to north America, I was shocked how little people made from ingredients and how much from ready-to-eat instant stuff.
Yup we eat a lot of ultra processed nonsense because we waste hours a day everyday just getting around the country and then even more time listening to pointy headed bosses. Our lives kinda suck it and most of it revolves around our jobs. The US is basically an industry-run dystopia.
My wife and I try to be better and buy real ingredients to make food, but after a long day at a shitty job it’s hard to find the energy to make a real meal instead of throwing some frozen rubbish into the oven for a few minutes.
Eating vegetables raw and plain is an acquired taste in today’s world. I got tired of steaming them a while ago.